Picking - Down/Up or Down/Down?

[Jaml]

I know that alternate picking [down/up] is the most used, but what about using all down-strokes?

Wes Montgomery didn't play with a pick, as we all know, but he must have used mainly down strokes with his thumb.
Does anyone here use mainly down-strokes with a pick? I know some blues players do.

Going back to alternate picking; usually it is down/up, but what about up/down - i.e., favouring the up-strokes?

Anyone favour mainly up-strokes?

And what about resting your picking hand on the guitar's body while picking?

Also, do you try and get as little movement as possible in the picking hand?

[Professor1]

All down strokes is too slow, and includes alot of wasted movement. You have to move your hand up anyway to make a downstroke, why not use it? I think of downstroke only stuff as a metal technique.

Watch closely, alot of the guys not using picks are picking down with their thumbs and up with thier first finger alternately, or to do octaves or drones in the case of some of the blues guys.

Upstrokes do sound different, and all upstrokes would be awkward, and might effect your rhythm.

Never rest your picking hand. Accuracy is NOT negatively affected. Plus, you can't strum if you can't move your hand. Also, your hand position when anchored has to be very poor just to be able to anchor.

Don't be affraid to move your picking hand all over the place if you want. It sould not hurt your accuracy. Accuracy comes from practice and feel. You can be taught everything but feel. That's why some most people are not surgeons. Why some auto mechanics are butchers. And why guitar players are often considered to be Neanderthals -- it seems the worst players are almost always loudest.

[Jaml]

I guess the tendency of a lot of solid-body electric guitar players to rest their picking hand on the guitar's body is due to their need to mute the strings by frequently placing the right-hand palm against the bridge.

With the kind gain that such guitars put out, it is necessary to keep things muted.

I accept what you say about this being bad technique.
Could you explain why - is it because of the need for wrist action?

[Professor1]

Jaml said:

I guess the tendency of a lot of solid-body electric guitar players to rest their picking hand on the guitar's body is due to their need to mute the strings by frequently placing the right-hand palm against the bridge.

With the kind gain that such guitars put out, it is necessary to keep things muted.

I accept what you say about this being bad technique.
Could you explain why - is it because of the need for wrist action?

I've never felt a need to use muting much, in particular not to such a degree that I had to rest my hand on the bridge. Besides, I don't like the tone there. I know alot of people feel a need to mute all the time, I never got a good explanation as to why. I suspect it hides sloppy playing.
Anchoring your hand by placing your pinky down causes your hand to be very scrunched up...like a claw. I feel that not only does this limit picking mobility, but also causes tension that can be destructive years down the road.

Plus, you can't do the big windmills on the really loud chords. ;D

[jazzalta]

I don't know Prof. I mute for effect, not to cover weaknesses. It can be very effective for specific dynamic purposes. But I suspect you're right for a lot of folks who use this device. I'm also one of those "claw" kind of guys. Been that way for years, 35 to be exact. Time will tell though if I end up with tendonitis, arthritis or other such condition. So far so good.

[Jaml]

It does seem that many rock guys anchor their right hands.

There is also the question of using the tremolo or vibrato arms - Cliff Gallup played with his right hand pinky wrapped around the vibrato bar most of the time!

However, I read that John McLaughlin, for example, advises that the right hand hover free above the face of the guitar.

I do believe though, that many rock styles *need* to have the right hand both muting at the bridge and holding the whammy bar.
With the fusion of jazz and rock guitar styles, some jazz players might look at these different right-hand techniques.

It was due to this difference in right hand techniques that Tommy Bolin was able to steal a march on jazz fusion players when he sessioned on Cobham's Spectrum album.
He was able to effectively use the whammy bar and power chord techniques unavailable to those who use the strict jazz right hand position.

However, perhaps all that stuff's been done, and clean, straightahead jazz picking is all that matters.

[Professor1]

Jaml said:

However, I read that John McLaughlin, for example, advises that the right hand hover free above the face of the guitar.

John's right. I guess my point was that if you are proficient at fingerpicking, and you should be because it's a basic rudimentary skill, then anchoring your right hand is unnecessary: picking accuracy is not defined by hand anchorage.

[jazzalta]

You know what Jaml, I think it's different strokes for different folks. I anchor my little finger whether I'm fingerpicking or flatpicking and I do just fine. The important thing is to get the note out. I've tried the floating thing and it just doesn't work for me. We're all different and should be content with our current method, especially if we've tried other approaches. I think there's way too much emphasis on the "right" or "wrong" way of playing. Play what is natural to you, not what or how some method book tells you.

[Jaml]

I know from my classical guitar studies that the correct right hand position is completely free and arched over the guitar front, with only the inner forearm resting on the top of the guitar [just above the lower bout].

Likewise for plectrum style, it stands to reason that a 'classic' approach would entail the right-hand being free above the guitar with only the forearm resting similarly.

However, we know that wonders can be accomplished with unorthodox styles.
Wes Montgomery is an obvious example. From pictures it seems that he splayed his right hand fingers, resting them onto the pickguard, while his thumb plucked the strings in mainly down-strokes!
Now if he had walked into a teacher with that approach he would have been 'corrected' straightway!

But then it could be argued that Wes was great *in spite* of that approach.

Surely the Proffessor is correct when he says that the righthand should be free - this must be the optimum approach that will yield unlimited results in the long-run [as John McLaughlin's technique demonstrates].

However, jazzalta is also right when he says that unorthodox styles are also 'right' when they yield excellent and original results.

I wonder, though, if it can be denied that the *tone* got by using the flesh of the thumb in consistent down-strokes is superior to that of alternate picking?
In other words, does alternate picking sacrifice some tone for greater facility?

[jazzalta]

Hi Jaml. Sorry if my post(s) have caused any confusion. The playing methods that you'll find from the academics are based on years and years of tried and tested techniques. They undoubedly produce or yield some outstanding results. I have nothing against a pursuit of excellence. I guess I'm offended by the self-righteous attitude that often accompanies formal teaching method advocates i.e. right vs. wrong.

[Jaml]

You're right to feel that way.

In jazz related music, when the best players are two with completely unorthodox techniques [Wes as already described, and Django Reinhardt (only had full use of two left hand fingers)], then you have a powerful point.

I suppose if we want to start with a 'blank slate' approach, then you'd want every player to have the 'correct' technique.

However, it does seem that the unorthodox often have the 'best tunes'!

But *any* teacher couldn't advise his pupils to use their thumb like Wes or only two fingers like Django; they'd have to show them 'correct' technique.

Jazz though, has always hitherto been a self-taught process, and so ultimately you are right.

[lancelll]

Wes had what was described as a "wart like callous " on his right thumb. It enabled him to achieve a better quality tone with his thumb and allowed him to have effective upstrokes. Although he played mainly downstrokes. Check out some of his rapid fire triplets when playing octaves! I would encourage checking out Bruno, Gypsy picking, Tuck's articles on the subject!